Polyglot and Shredder...

Archive of the old Parsimony forum. Some messages couldn't be restored. Limitations: Search for authors does not work, Parsimony specific formats do not work, threaded view does not work properly. Posting is disabled.

Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Roger Brown » 25 Apr 2004, 16:39

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 25 April 2004 17:39:20:

Hello all,
This Polyglot tool is a must have for folks wishing to combine the best of the Winboard and UCI worlds in the rock solid Winboard gui. yes, I know about Arena (a sexy, gorgeous gui) and this is not an anti-Arena post either, so do not go there....
I am wondering if anyone is having problems re hanging issues with Shredder used in conjunction with Polyglot? Is this a Shredder problem only?
I am encountering hanging Polyglots and Shredders all the time.
I am using Polyglot with Shredder and Bookthinker (to provide an opening book for the engine). I use Jori's WBTM which is really neat once you get the hang of it. WBTM is the TD and calls up Winboard through the winboard.ini, another lovely feature of this program.
What I would like to have is the exact winboard.ini configuration that someone has used which eliminates the hanging issues with Shredder. Do not tell me to add xrated (or xreuseable or xboredtotears) to the command line. Copy and paste the actual section of your winboard.ini here so I can see it, please.
Thanks much for any responses to my desperate appeal.
Later.
The technical stuff (as if it matters... :-) )
Pentium III
ME
800+ mhz
500+ mb of ram
The latest Polyglot April 21, 2004 (80 kb)
WBTM
Winboard 4.26
Roger Brown
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Norm Pollock » 25 Apr 2004, 16:52

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Norm Pollock at 25 April 2004 17:52:10:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 25 April 2004 17:39:20:
Hello all,
This Polyglot tool is a must have for folks wishing to combine the best of the Winboard and UCI worlds in the rock solid Winboard gui. yes, I know about Arena (a sexy, gorgeous gui) and this is not an anti-Arena post either, so do not go there....
I am wondering if anyone is having problems re hanging issues with Shredder used in conjunction with Polyglot? Is this a Shredder problem only?
I am encountering hanging Polyglots and Shredders all the time.
I am using Polyglot with Shredder and Bookthinker (to provide an opening book for the engine). I use Jori's WBTM which is really neat once you get the hang of it. WBTM is the TD and calls up Winboard through the winboard.ini, another lovely feature of this program.
What I would like to have is the exact winboard.ini configuration that someone has used which eliminates the hanging issues with Shredder. Do not tell me to add xrated (or xreuseable or xboredtotears) to the command line. Copy and paste the actual section of your winboard.ini here so I can see it, please.
Thanks much for any responses to my desperate appeal.
Later.
The technical stuff (as if it matters... :-) )
Pentium III
ME
800+ mhz
The latest Polyglot April 21, 2004 (80 kb)
WBTM
Winboard 4.26
1>500+ mb of ram
I do not have Shredder. But I had similar problems with sos4, list, and lgnemesis using jori's wbtm.
My suggestion is to make the following additions to the winboard.ini for Shredder:
(1) add -xreuse and -firstEngineProtocol 1 for the first engine
(2) add -xreuse2 and -secondEngine Protocol 1 for the second engine
(3) remove all references to Nalimov tbs in the polyglot.ini file (or whatever you renamed the file).
Here is an example of (1):
"bookthinker polyglot polyglot.ini" -fd "f:\winboard\list" -xreuse -firstProtocolVersion 1 ; /name="list"
Here is an example of (2):
"bookthinker polyglot polyglot.ini" -sd "f:\winboard\list" -xreuse2 -secondProtocolVersion 1 ; /name="list"
These adjustments solved the same type of problem with SOS4, List, and LGNemesis. Maybe they will also do the same with Shredder.
Norm Pollock
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Mogens Larsen » 25 Apr 2004, 18:29

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Mogens Larsen at 25 April 2004 19:29:52:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 25 April 2004 17:39:20:
Hello all,
This Polyglot tool is a must have for folks wishing to combine the best of the Winboard and UCI worlds in the rock solid Winboard gui. yes, I know about Arena (a sexy, gorgeous gui) and this is not an anti-Arena post either, so do not go there....
I am wondering if anyone is having problems re hanging issues with Shredder used in conjunction with Polyglot? Is this a Shredder problem only?
Well, I've been trying to connect good old Shredder 5 to WinBoard using bookthinker and Polyglot. Without much success I might add. But since I'm not too keen on adding reuse and protocolversion stuff further tests have been abandoned. SOS and Little Goliath were the important engines for my purpose, so I'm more than pleased with their addition. That doesn't really help your cause. However, if there were no problems in human existance, then we would be deprived the enjoyment of ovecoming them.
Regards,
Mogens
Mogens Larsen
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Roger Brown » 25 Apr 2004, 19:57

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 25 April 2004 20:57:01:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Mogens Larsen at 25 April 2004 19:29:52:

SOS and Little Goliath were the important engines for my purpose, so I'm more than pleased with their addition.

Ah well, could you post the winboard.ini for these please? I suppose I will be getting around to using them...
:-)

That doesn't really help your cause. However, if there were no problems in human existance, then we would be deprived the enjoyment of ovecoming them.

Nominated for deepest post of the year!

Later.
Roger Brown
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Roger Brown » 26 Apr 2004, 01:14

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 26 April 2004 02:14:45:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Norm Pollock at 25 April 2004 17:52:10:

Hello Norm,
I will try your suggestions for some other engines I have which you mentioned.
Your workaround does not work here for Shredder.
Thanks.
Later.
Roger Brown
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Fabien Letouzey » 26 Apr 2004, 11:24

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Fabien Letouzey at 26 April 2004 12:24:57:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Mogens Larsen at 25 April 2004 19:29:52:

Well, I've been trying to connect good old Shredder 5 to WinBoard using bookthinker and Polyglot. Without much success I might add. But since I'm not too keen on adding reuse and protocolversion stuff further tests have been abandoned. SOS and Little Goliath were the important engines for my purpose, so I'm more than pleased with their addition. That doesn't really help your cause. However, if there were no problems in human existance, then we would be deprived the enjoyment of ovecoming them.
What were the symptoms with Shredder?
Fabien.
Fabien Letouzey
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Fabien Letouzey » 26 Apr 2004, 11:32

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Fabien Letouzey at 26 April 2004 12:32:07:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 25 April 2004 17:39:20:

I am wondering if anyone is having problems re hanging issues with Shredder used in conjunction with Polyglot? Is this a Shredder problem only?
No, I more and more strongly suspect it is a problem in the WBTMs. Does the problem occur with just WinBoard (you can use the /mg option for multiple games)?
As I explained before, hanging can only happen if there is *also* a problem in the engine. This is why the problem appears to be engine specific, but it isn't.
Fabien.
Fabien Letouzey
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Mogens Larsen » 26 Apr 2004, 14:47

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Mogens Larsen at 26 April 2004 15:47:31:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 25 April 2004 20:57:01:
Ah well, could you post the winboard.ini for these please? I suppose I will be getting around to using them...
:-)
It's very simple
"SOS SOS.ini" /sd=C:\Engines\SOS
"SOS SOS.ini" /fd=C:\Engines\SOS
where SOS is Polyglot renamed and SOS.ini its initialization file.
Similar method for Little Goliath. I use a separate polyglot for each engine.
Regards,
Mogens
Mogens Larsen
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Mogens Larsen » 26 Apr 2004, 14:55

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Mogens Larsen at 26 April 2004 15:55:21:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Fabien Letouzey at 26 April 2004 12:24:57:
What were the symptoms with Shredder?
In my setup, which is
"Shredder-5 polyglot" /sd=C:\Engines\Shredder
where Shredder-5 is bookthinker, the first game is completed succesfully. But WinBoard displays a "Waiting for first/second chess program" after its completion. Nothing happens after that.
The end of the shredder log looks like this:


> ENGINE go wtime 57730 btime 30920 winc 3000 binc 3000 ponder
< ENGINE info string PB:  57.73 sec to go (3.19, 11.35)
< ENGINE info nps 0 cpuload 937 hashfull 0 
< XBOARD time 5770
POLYGLOT *** GUESS 57.730 ***
POLYGLOT *** EXACT 57.700 ***
< XBOARD otim 3381
< XBOARD usermove g8h7
POLYGLOT MOVE Kh7
> XBOARD 1/2-1/2 {Draw by fifty-move rule}
POLYGLOT WAITING
< XBOARD result 1/2-1/2 {Draw by fifty-move rule}
POLYGLOT GAME END
POLYGLOT STOP SEARCH
> ENGINE stop
POLYGLOT WAITING
< ENGINE bestmove 0000
< XBOARD force
POLYGLOT WAITING
< XBOARD ping 1
> XBOARD pong 1
< XBOARD new
POLYGLOT NEW GAME
POLYGLOT WAITING
> ENGINE ucinewgame
< ENGINE info string illegal command
< XBOARD new
POLYGLOT NEW GAME
POLYGLOT WAITING
> ENGINE ucinewgame
< XBOARD random
< XBOARD level 0 5 3
< XBOARD post
< XBOARD hard
POLYGLOT WAITING
> ENGINE setoption name Ponder value true
< ENGINE info string illegal command
< XBOARD EOF
POLYGLOT *** QUIT ***
> ENGINE quit
> ENGINE EOF
</tt>

Regards,
Mogens
Mogens Larsen
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Fabien Letouzey » 26 Apr 2004, 15:16

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Fabien Letouzey at 26 April 2004 16:16:50:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Mogens Larsen at 26 April 2004 15:55:21:

What were the symptoms with Shredder?
In my setup, which is
"Shredder-5 polyglot" /sd=C:\Engines\Shredder
where Shredder-5 is bookthinker, the first game is completed succesfully. But WinBoard displays a "Waiting for first/second chess program" after its completion. Nothing happens after that.
These symptoms would be explained if you used protover 2 (which is the default). This is a problem in BookThinker (not just the fact that it does not understand protover2, which would be OK).
If you used protover 1, you might have found a new problem.
Fabien.
Fabien Letouzey
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Mogens Larsen » 26 Apr 2004, 16:16

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Mogens Larsen at 26 April 2004 17:16:39:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Fabien Letouzey at 26 April 2004 16:16:50:
These symptoms would be explained if you used protover 2 (which is the default). This is a problem in BookThinker (not just the fact that it does not understand protover2, which would be OK).
Yes, I didn't switch to protocol version 1.
It was just a bookthinker experiment without reuse or protocol shenanighans.
No new problems discovered.
Regards,
Mogens
Mogens Larsen
 

Re: Polyglot and Shredder...

Postby Fabien Letouzey » 26 Apr 2004, 16:33

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Fabien Letouzey at 26 April 2004 17:33:53:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Mogens Larsen at 26 April 2004 17:16:39:

These symptoms would be explained if you used protover 2 (which is the default). This is a problem in BookThinker (not just the fact that it does not understand protover2, which would be OK).
Yes, I didn't switch to protocol version 1.
It was just a bookthinker experiment without reuse or protocol shenanighans.
Yes it is bad to try them randomly. Instead understanding where the problem comes from helps.
For protocol version: always use version 1 with BookThinker. I don't think it's needed in any other case.
The xreuse work around is for other problems (various I am afraid, in both the tourney managers and some engines).
Fabien.
Fabien Letouzey
 

Thanks Mogens (n/t)

Postby Roger Brown » 26 Apr 2004, 18:51

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 26 April 2004 19:51:02:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Polyglot and Shredder... geschrieben von:/posted by: Mogens Larsen at 26 April 2004 15:47:31:
Roger Brown
 


Return to Archive (Old Parsimony Forum)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 18 guests